Coast To Coast Creatives
Coast To Coast Creatives
The Spirit of Independent Filmmaking: Exploring the Legacy of John Cassavetes
In this episode, the focus is on indie filmmaking and the influential work of filmmaker John Cassavetes. I welcome old friend, Taurean Cavins-Flores, who's bringing Cassavetes to life in the new stage production, 'Independent: John Cassavetes and the Birth of American Independent Filmmaking'. Taurean discuss Cassavetes' pioneering spirit, his background and his approach to filmmaking. The episode delves into the challenges of embodying Cassavetes, the emotional depth of his films, and the production process of the play, resistance to Hollywood studios, his distinct artistic vision, and his intense relationship with his wife, Gena Rowlands. The conversation provides insights into the preparation and dedication required to portray such a complex figure & is a must-listen for anyone interested in fearless storytelling, the struggles and triumphs of indie filmmaking, and the enduring impact of Cassavetes' work.
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Joe: Welcome back to another episode of 'Coast to Coast Creatives'. Today, we're stepping into the world of indie filmmaking, raw storytelling, and artistic rebellion, all through the lens of one of the most influential, independent filmmakers of all time. John Cassavetes. Joining me is actor and old friend Taurean Cavins-Flores, who's bringing Cassavetes to life in the upcoming stage production, Independent, John Cassavetes and the Birth of American Independent Filmmaking.
We'll talk about the process of stepping into the mind of the cinematic trailblazer, the raw emotionality of Cassavetes work, and what it means to carve your own creative path. If you're an actor, filmmaker, or just someone who loves fearless storytelling. This episode is for you. Okay, let's dive on in.
How are you doing today, Taurean? It's good to see you. You too. Um, we've been talking about this project of yours for, I don't know, probably like a year now you've been, you've been working on it. So I know a lot about it at this point. Yeah. Um, but not everybody knows even about John Cassavetes.
Yeah. Um, so At this at the start here you've done so much research.
Taurean: Yes, I have
Joe: for this Tell me who is John Cassavetes?
Taurean: 1950s through the 80s until he passed he was a filmmaker actor director writer but what he did was basically pioneer independent filmmaking in America. And yeah, in the 1950s in America, that was unheard of.
And, you know, going outside of the, the, the studios and doing it on your own, because, you know, this was the quote. Golden age of Hollywood, you know, so studios kind of owned everybody that worked for them You know, this was a time when actors were under contract at studios, you know be like we'll sign you on to do Five movies at a time.
We don't know what they'll be but you're signed on to do five movies. Whatever we want you to do so the fact that he he went outside of the studios and made his own stuff was just Blew everybody away. Kind of remarkable.
Joe: Yeah. And did he come from a theater background? How did he get into the world of film?
Was he more of a writer, a stage performer, stage director?
Taurean: He was, uh, he, he, he started out as an actor. Yeah. So he was kind of just kind of a lost soul. Didn't exactly know what he wanted to do. Um, his father and brother were. Like genius minds, you know, very scholarly, all of that. And John was not. And so, um, there's a line in the play where his mom is kind of, you know, lashing out at him saying, You flunked out of college, you mope around the house, when are you going to stop acting like a bum?
And, uh, he ends up running into some friends, um, Who are signing up at the American Academy of Dramatic Arts to be actors. And so Basically, he was like, well, I'm gonna be an actor and his mom was like, no, you're not But he did and so yeah, he went to the American Academy of Dramatic Arts Only after he Auditioned for Strasburg at the actor's studio Two or three times and he got turned down This is a very interesting story.
Um, he got turned down. And turned down again. So he went back, I believe it was three times. He went back a third time. And said he had a piece to do for his audition. Um, but it was a scene, so he was going to do it with his friend. And so he's auditioning in front of Strasburg. And Strasburg, like, loved it.
And I love it. You're in and Cassavetes was like, well, I don't have money. And he's like, doesn't matter. I'll give you a scholarship. Uh, and just so you know, this whole scene was made up from a play that doesn't even exist. So he, he, he did this to just kind of like spite Strasburg and Strasburg bought it.
But that's the kind of guy that Cassavetes was, you know, he was just like. anti establishment, anti studio, just all of that. And so, and then he was like, uh, yeah, it's made up. Uh, so bye. And then he ended up going to the American Academy of Dramatic Arts.
Joe: That reminds me of a story I heard Henry Winkler, uh, tell.
For our younger viewers, that's the Fonz. That's the Fonz. That's the Fonz. Um, when he was, Auditioning for Juilliard, he went in with a Shakespeare piece, and when he got up in front of the panel, he completely forgot his monologue. He blanked. So he made up a Shakespearean monologue on the spot, and kind of the same reaction, they said, Oh, we really like that, that was kind of nice.
Probably a little bit more obvious with Shakespearean that you're making it up off the top of your head. Yeah. Iambic pentameter off the top of your head is not easy. No. Um. Oh, that's, that's, that's really fascinating.
Taurean: Yeah.
Joe: So how many Cassavetes films did you watch in preparation for this role? Spoiler,
In, in this, in this project you are playing John Cassavetes.
Taurean: I am. Yeah. Uh, so yeah. How, how many, I had a couple other
Joe: people. How many of of his films did you watch in preparation?
Taurean: Uh, all of them. Uh, so I started out wanting to, um. Watch them as I got to them in the book. But like I said, I'm a slow reader.
And then taking notes on top of that. So I was just like, I'm just gonna watch them whenever I can. And uh, started with uh, shadows. I wanted to go sequentially. Um, but uh, That didn't exactly happen. But yeah, shadows, uh, faces, husbands, uh, opening night, and then, um, there are some more. But then, uh, Woman Under the Influence was the one I watched most recently.
And, uh, it was great to just kind of see his growth. You see shadows and you're like, okay, this is very It is It looks very independent, you know, yeah. When you have that idea in your head, you know, very independent, but artsy and it's got, um, I don't, I don't want to say artsy. He hated that, um, uh, art films.
He, he thought they were pretentious, but there's just a very honest film, um, about, yeah, just on, all his films are just honest about things that we may not necessarily know about, but. Um, anyway, so Shadows comes off as, Independent, but then you see his growth and they start to look more like movies but not in a bad way not in a bad way at all, but woman under the influence is incredible and that's like the the centerpiece of that movie is general Rollins his wife and she's just She's a goddess.
She's she's a powerhouse in that movie Yeah, so Anybody who hasn't seen that, see that. It's incredible. Yeah.
Joe: Tell us a little bit about the relationship between John Cassavetes and his wife.
Taurean: Tumultuous, to say the least. Um, Not, not really in like a, a dark kind of way, but, um, He was very stubborn and opinionated, yada yada, you know.
And, uh, he, you know, He called himself like a street kid from New York, right? Which, you know, he was. So you, you know, that Wording conjures an idea, an image of a person. And yeah, that was a lot of him. Jenna was very refined and, um, elegant. But she didn't put up with anything. You know, so, um, Yeah, she didn't roll over for John at all.
You know, um, there's a line in the play when, uh, John says, I knew I'd met my match. You know, cause she wasn't gonna put up with any of his stuff. So There were hard times because John took his work so seriously. And he would, when he got into, when he was shooting a film, it would just take him over, like he was in a trance.
It's all he would be doing. And, um, you know, I mean, in another relationship you might, be like, oh, that's, that's kind of neglectful. But Jenna loved him so much and supported him in everything that he did that it wasn't, it wasn't exactly neglect. It was like, okay, he's going to make a movie. We both know what's going to happen.
This is what it is. And That's what he would do, uh, not to say that there weren't problems because of that. Um, you know, uh, a big part of it because of the time period when nobody was making their own films, he, uh, he would have to, what he would do, he would basically go actor direct for, you know, a studio.
Or a network or something like that, make money and use that money to, you know, make films and pay people back who helped them make the films, you know, so there was a lot of time in his life when he was in debt. Um, so they loved each other so much, but some of the hardship also came from, you know, being in debt to these people who helped him on the films and stuff like that.
So there were a lot of things that. Made it bumpy, but they just loved so fiercely that it just, it, it worked, that it just worked, you know?
Joe: And the show, the construction of the show, it is a two person show, correct? There's two actors? Yes,
Taurean: so, yeah, more or less, yeah. So I play John, and uh, Madeline Brashear, MJ, plays uh, Jenna.
And The whole setup of the play is, there was a moment in John's life, he made a movie called A Child is Waiting, with Burt Lancaster and Judy Garland, produced by Stanley Kramer, who was like the biggest producer in Hollywood at the time. Same, around the same time a mad, it's a mad, mad, mad, mad world came out and all of that, you know, huge movies, huge producer.
And so he got John to come, uh, direct, uh, A Child is Waiting for him. John got really close to the material, was really passionate about it, was a subject he cared about. And Stanley Kramer felt, we'll just say it wasn't Stanley's vision. It wasn't what Stanley wanted, right? Uh, so John put all of himself into this movie.
Um, and, long story short, he sits through the edit, that's not his edit, and, uh, after the screening ends, he goes up grabs Stanley Kramer by the throat and says, take my name off the picture, lets him go and then walks out right to the back alley of the studio and Kramer follows him and they get into a fight.
And this, now this is according to Cassavetes. They get into a fight in the back alley and John thinks to himself, all right, I knew I had a choice to make if I hit you, I'll never work again, you know, but if I don't hit you, I'll never breathe again. And so he hits. Stanley Kramer right in the jaw and, uh, drops him and then Freaks out because he just hit the biggest producer in Hollywood, right?
runs across the street to this Chinese restaurant on Sunset Boulevard and Goes into the bathroom and just like says puking his guts out and like just re evaluating his life And that's the play the play the entire play takes place In that Chinese restaurant bathroom. Oh,
Joe: wow.
Taurean: And it's just John re evaluating his life.
So, um, when, uh, uh, when Gena comes into, uh, uh, into the play and everything, it's like me reflecting on my life. And then she's kind of like this beautiful specter that comes in and, you know, we have a little conversation and, um, yeah, there is, um, And so yeah, that's kind of how she, she's involved in the play.
She's kind of like my, my solace within this whole freak out in this bathroom.
Joe: Okay. Okay. Tell me a little bit about how you specifically Prepared to play John Cassavetes outside of outside of the the research, obviously What was your mental state going into it? And how did you find? Ways to to get in character.
Taurean: Sure so, um, I I, I teach as well and I, I tell my students, you know, it's good to have like technique to fall back on, you know, to, to use out of your tool belt, but sometimes a piece you'll just read it and it'll hit you and you just kind of get it. And once you do like ride that wave. And that was, that was what happened with me with independent.
Um, John gave it to me. I read it. Uh. Yeah. Yeah. And I was like crying after reading it. I was just like, this makes so much sense. So, you know, there you go. I didn't have to do, I didn't have to do a whole lot of like emotional preparation or anything like that. I just kind of just, just got it in my body.
But, you know, John Cassavetes was a, a character to say the least. And, um, so he has a, a very, a very interesting voice, uh, that, If you don't do it right it could come off as kind of cartoony, you know, so I watched a lot of video You know just listening to his voice, especially in the time This play is set because it does get a little deeper as he gets older, but that's not when the play is set.
So New York II kind of high pitched it could go cartoony if you if you do it wrong, but then a big thing is He was just always Smoking He almost always had a cigarette in his hand, right? And, um, so I, uh, I, I bought some cigarettes. And I, you know, I didn't, uh, I didn't need to smoke them or anything because it wasn't about that and you shouldn't smoke anyway.
But, um, It's like in his gestures. There's so many, you know, interviews and stuff where he has a cigarette in his hand and it's just part of his gesture, you know, and so I would go through the play with a cigarette in my hand, whether he had a cigarette in the play or not, and just have it and let it feed the gestures and then got rid of the cigarette and still had it feed the gestures.
Because if you watch a footage of him, the way he gestures his hands, it's still like he's. It's just like in his body, um, it's, and it, it, um, it was, it was really interesting cause it played such a big part in, uh, kind of enveloping myself in that just. Having a cigarette all the time. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Joe: And then as far as the artistic philosophies of Cassavetes, when you were reading the script, what did you, what resonated with you the most?
What, what, what similarities do you find between yourself and John?
Taurean: Uh, so much. So, so many. Um, John is very much Can we please have some respect for what we're doing? Can we please have honesty in what we're doing? You know, um, and belief that, that we're doing something as, as actors and filmmakers and, you know, uh, uh, playwrights.
We're, we're doing something that's important. And, um, uh, in the, in the play, there's a line where he says, uh, he's talking about acting and how, um, Uh, worldwide communication in a world so incapable of understanding. And so he just, he had these hard beliefs that just, we, we need to be human and honest with ourselves and honest with everybody else.
And, um, like, can we please stop just bowing down to this corporate. Money grubbing thing that is Hollywood and the industry. Can we please stop that? And I, I, especially right now, I feel that so much, you know? And it's like, don't get me wrong, like the blockbusters have their, have their place and everything like that.
I like a good popcorn movie too, like you do. I know you love a good popcorn movie, you know? But, you know, there is a point where it's, it's Now, so many of them just kind of seem like there's just no shame and it's very just obviously money grubbing, you know, and it's like, and they know exactly what they're doing.
They're not trying to make art, you know, and Cassavetes was like, let's, let's make something honest. Um, I keep referencing the play, but you know, I think it's appropriate. So there's a moment in the play when they're on a, there's a scene in the play when they're on a talk show. And they're talking about shadows and how, you know, they went about shooting it.
And they're talking about how they went into it with the script only three quarters of the way done. And the talk show host is like, well, you know, three quarters, why? And Cassavetes says, well, you know, I think it helps the performances. Um, we figure it out. Together a couple days before and then that's how we shoot it and he's like, I think it helps and then the talk show host Says well, doesn't that you know mess with the film's message and I just kind of fly off the handle and I'm like, no This is not a movie with a message Shadows is an honest movie, you know, it's like we're not and he says we're not We're creating art And I don't believe the purpose of art is propagandizing, you know?
And it's like, you know, it's not to say that art shouldn't, uh, have a message because I think it should, but just the fact that he's like, no, there's no message within this movie. It's an honest movie. It's a human movie. We're not hiding behind anything. We're not trying to trick you into anything. This is just people.
Here you go. You know, people just. Bearing it all, you know, whether whether it's pretty or not It's real and I think that's it's just that's it hits me hard Joe. Yeah Yeah, it sounds like it sounds like you have a lot of a lot of similarities
Joe: with Cassavetes. Is there any aspect? Yeah, you know me. Is there any aspect of his personality?
That you don't gel with. Something, something with his personality that scares you, potentially.
Taurean: With his personality that maybe I see within myself?
Joe: No, no, no. That you don't see within yourself. Something that, something that, you're like, that's,
Taurean: I don't
Joe: recognize this in myself.
Taurean: Yeah, sure. I, um, I don't, I don't drink and smoke as much as he does.
I don't smoke at all, and I don't drink as much as he does. And we were actually, uh We're joking around and, um, only half joking because we might do this, but, uh, if we're, uh, if we were able to, like, sell alcohol, sell drinks, uh, at the theater in the lobby, we would have a, uh, we would have drink specials, you know, we would have, we would have the Gena, you know, and that would be something fancy, like a French 75 or something like that, you know, or an aviation, um, and then we'd have the, the Cassavetes special, which would just be.
Like four ounces of scotch. Yeah. In
Joe: a scotch? Yeah,
Taurean: four ounces of scotch. And then we looked up on Amazon, uh, they actually, uh, they actually sell straws that look like cigarettes. Oh,
Speaker 3: okay.
Taurean: So we would do that and then just like throw a cigarette straw in there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Another thing that I saw,
Joe: I recently went to a tiki bar where they made me a drink, a tiki drink.
And they took a cinnamon stick and they took a lighter and they burned the end of that and it smokes like,
Taurean: Yeah.
Joe: Like a cigarette. Yeah, we
Taurean: can absolutely do that. Kind of looks
Joe: like a blunt though, so I don't know if that's Yeah,
Taurean: no, I don't, I don't Yeah,
Joe: no. The ideas of what you're going for.
Taurean: No, he was not a pothead, but he, uh, he drank and smoked a lot.
Joe: Yeah.
Taurean: Yeah. So I don't, uh, yeah, that's, that's not part of me, but the whole, um, I mean, like I said, you, you know, me as your friend and yeah, very, I'm very, can we just be honest and real?
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Taurean: For like two. Damn seconds, please. Yeah, it's you know, how frustrated I get. Oh, yeah. Yeah
Joe: How do you think Cassavetes would fare in the landscape of How do you think, yes, there are so many blockbusters, but there is also such a great opportunity for independent filmmakers. If we plopped him into 2025, how do you think he would feel?
Taurean: I think, um, I think he would, I think there would be less walls for him to break down.
I think in a way he would thrive nowadays. Um, but. And the spooky thing is that the themes in this play from the fifties and sixties, the themes in this play are more pertinent now than they were 10 years ago. Even, you know, um, we feel that there has been, there's been loss of respect for real stories, honest stories about people.
Um, there's been loss of respect for that. And, um, it's, it's a problem. It really is a problem. There are some great movies out there that are about people. You know, there's some great independent stuff. But that doesn't mean that it's not hard to make. It is, it is so hard to get, you know, approval on anything of any importance.
You know, it was that way back in the 50s and 60s, and it's that way now. Um, There's a lot more outlets now for independent film. So yeah, it's going to thrive a little more than No outlets at all back in the 50s, you know,
Speaker 3: yeah
Taurean: Um, but uh, just because there are more things out there now that are independent and have something to say It doesn't mean that It's safe.
It doesn't mean that that That that that that kind of expression is safe in this day and age it is There are people still trying to slap that down.
Taurean: people still trying to slap that down and all they care about is making a buck and they Don't give a crap about anything that doesn't make money.
Yeah, you know money So much of it, most of it just comes down to money. So, you know, to everybody out there listening and watching this, when you see something independent, when you see something that is outside of the norm, appreciate it. You know? Like, really think about the appreciation you should hold for it.
Because it was damn hard to make.
Joe: Yeah.
Taurean: Yeah.
Joe: I feel like he would probably find a home with a place like A24. Yeah,
Taurean: A24, similarly, um, you know, Neon, I'd like to see him make a neon film. He'd probably have, I mean he, no, not probably, he would have his own studio. He would have his own, yeah, and that's what it would be.
He, he, he wouldn't work for Definitely not a big studio and he wouldn't do a marvel. He could do an avengers Well, that's the thing about what he did he? He kind of despised it all but found a way to use it, you know, so, you know for some reason he did Keep getting hired in Hollywood So he would make his own movies run out of money and then go make something studio and just use all the money You know, for his next movie and supporting his family and it was just a cycle of that throughout his whole life.
He just kept doing that and doing that. Um, like he's in Rosemary's Baby and he, he hated that. You know, he's very good and grounded. He's great in that movie, but he, he hated doing it, you know, because he felt that there was no individual expression for himself. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Tell
Joe: me what, what has it been like collaborating with your buddy, John Babcock on this?
Taurean: Um, it's, it's been amazing. It's been absolutely amazing. Um, we both adore acting, filmmaking. We're both just a couple of cinephiles and um, He brought this to my attention. We were having a late night dinner at the Marietta diner and we were talking about movies, of course and he brought up this play that he wrote and I was like that sounds amazing and he had done it back in 2017 or 2018 and went through a couple performances And I was like, do you want to like do it again?
This sounds incredible and he's like, yeah, I've been thinking about it I'm like, let's Let's do it. Please. I'm like, send me the script. This sounds amazing. And you know, that's when I read the script and I cried and I was like, well, we gotta do this. And so that's when producing this thing started. Uh, you've been hearing about it for a year.
It's been in production for like. Probably eight months already. It's been crazy.
Joe: I haven't seen you produce a theatrical piece on this level. Yeah. And it seems like you're learning a lot. I'm learning. In the process. I'm
Taurean: learning a lot. A lot, a lot, uh, you like
Joe: and a lot you don't like. Yeah. What, what about the process of being a producer has been the most eye opening?
Let's say that.
Taurean: Um, well, I was, uh, Like it's a, it's a different experience, um, than when you just have to memorize your lines. You know, give me that all day. That's great. That's great. Nothing to worry about. But now it's like, okay, I gotta worry about, um, you know, checking out, uh, uh, uh, The lighting board and the lighting setups at the theater, which we did last weekend, and it's all just a mess.
So my lighting designer's gonna have to fix that. Um, and, uh, you know, just like, you know, the Um, locking down the theater itself for months. Wow. And I was just, and it shouldn't, but I was like the middleman between negotiations, you know, of like what each theater needs because authenticity theater is, is producing.
And then we're holding the, um, show at limelight's black box downtown. And so, you know, they both have things that they need. And so. They don't all line up together, which is fine, because they're different entities. But I'm in the middle of it all, being like, can we do this? Or maybe this? Or, like, let's meet some middle ground here.
And, uh, there were a lot of, sure, okay, we can do that. And then there were a lot of, no, we're not moving on that. Um, which I, I understand. Uh, but it's just been, so there's, it's not just learning lines. It's dealing with that stuff. And, um, uh, you know. Casting, um, we only needed to cast one person, you know, but that's another added thing.
That was a really fun day, though. That was a really fun day. Yeah, I gotta imagine. Yeah, it was really fun. Um, but yeah, it's just, and then, you know, things seem to keep arising, you know? Yeah. Like, oh, here's another problem. And you're only
Joe: now a little over a month away from opening.
Taurean: Yeah, so, um, I try, I, I think of it as almost two months, because then that makes me feel better, like, oh, okay, two months, two months, not, not just over a month.
Yeah. Um, we open last weekend in April. Mm hmm. And, uh, we go through the first weekend in May, so it's six performances total. Um, but yeah, we are We are right there. So, on top of everything else, we're in rehearsals now, too, which are going great. And, uh, yeah. Yeah. It's been a whirlwind, man. Yeah.
Joe: Yeah, you've put so much Into this
Taurean: yeah, I'm sorry, and then there's the social media stuff that I got to take care of too And yeah, if I had money I would hire a social media expert, but I don't So I get it We gotta do that all on ourselves too.
Anyway, continue.
Joe: Yeah, it's a lot of work. You understand why those social media managers are one position. Yeah. It's one person's, one person's job to handle. Yeah. Speaking of social media. Yeah. Uh, where can people go to follow this journey? Yeah. Follow the story?
Taurean: It's uh, um, yeah. It's going to be, I'm gonna be, Posting some things on, on my own Instagram account.
Um, and then I think we're going to make, um, a page for the show itself. Uh, and the show itself is, it's called Independent. That's the name of the show. Um.
Joe: That's not the full name of the show. I made the, I made the poster.
Taurean: Yeah, you made the poster. The, uh, the original name of the show is Independent. And then, uh, somebody within all of this, uh, thought that we needed a, uh, what do you call that, a byline?
Yeah, just like a sub, subtitle. Subtitle, yeah. So it's, it's Ind, Independent. And then, the sub is, um, Independent. John Cassavetes and the birth of American independent filmmaking. Yeah, it's a lot to fit on a poster. It
Joe: was a lot to fit on the poster. And another, another challenging part of the poster was, I thought you guys were challenging me to see how many names we could, how many times we could put the name John on a poster.
Oh. Because you had John Cassavetes. Yeah, John Babcock and then John Carucci,
Taurean: who's our stage manager and lighting designer and everything else. So there's a whole
Joe: team of Johns working on this picture. It takes a village of Johns.
Taurean: It does, and the play takes place in the John of a Chinese restaurant.
Joe: Oh, there we go!
Another John. Yeah. So, summing it all up, um, When does it open? Give us that location one more time.
Taurean: The last weekend in April, which is, uh, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, the 25th, 26th, 27th, and then the first weekend in May, which is, uh, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th. Um, Friday and Saturdays will be at 7. 30 p. m. And then, uh, everybody loves a matinee, so Sundays will be at 4 p.
m. And this will be at Limelight Theater in downtown Atlanta.
Joe: Amazing. Yeah,
Taurean: in the black box.
Joe: Go, uh, in the show notes he'll obviously put any information about, about the show, the website, the Instagram, all the Instagrams that Torim personally handles that you can go, go check out his work, give him some hearts, give him some likes on all of that work.
Um, we're gonna ask with, we're gonna end with one question that is, if you could ask John Cassavetes one question about his work, what would it be? What would you ask him?
Taurean: I think I understand him, um, on a very emotional level. So, for a moment I was going to say, where does all this, you know, the thirst for honesty and truth come from?
The want for that, where does that come from? But I think I understand that. I would kind of, I think I would want to ask him just how all of that hunger and thirst for truth and honesty How does the burden of wanting to be so honest and truthful, or rather explore truth and honesty on a human level? How do you feel like carrying that around on a daily basis?
That's what I would ask him. Yeah.
Joe: Well, I'm so excited to, to see the show myself. Uh, All of this research that you've been doing. I know that it's all going to be paying off for you and and Kudos to you for everything that you and John Babcock are putting into this. I encourage everybody to go see it It's gonna be it's gonna be really really wonderful show Again, please check out all this information in the show notes Are there any final things that you would like to pass along to the listeners?
Taurean: Uh, I think, um, like I said, next time you go see something that's a little off the beaten path, maybe an A24 film or something like that, just really take a second to sit in it and appreciate it. Um, and stay through the final credits, the end credits too, you know? Um. Just so you have the whole experience because you're missing out on a great score, probably if you don't stay through the entire credits, um, but I, you know, selfishly, I'll say, come see this show, uh, because it's like I said, the themes in it are more relevant today than they were even 10 years ago.
It's an important show to see. Um, it, it just is, it's something that. You need to hear. Yeah. Yeah. You know, you, you don't have to be an actor, you don't have to be a movie lover. Um, you don't even have to be a theater lover, you know, but we're all human and we all like Cassavetes hold this, you know, thirst and hunger for truth and insight into, um, however cliche this sounds, the human experience.
And so, you know, we're all human and we all like Cassavetes hold this, you know, thirst and hunger for truth and insight into, um, however cliche
Speaker 3: this sounds, the
Taurean: human experience. And so, You need to hear the things that are in this play. It'll do you some good. It will. And, uh, it is very fun as well.
Joe: Beautiful. I can't wait to see it. Yeah. Well, thank you so much, Torn, for being here today and for chatting about your project. Maybe we'll have to have John in to talk a little bit more. I would love that. We'll get all three of you in. Yeah, that'd be great. To talk about the project. Yeah. And yeah, thank you so much.
It's great seeing you, great chatting with you as always. You too. And I can't wait to see all of your hard work pay off. Thank you.